Board Thread:Custom Lore Development/@comment-25344655-20160525185438/@comment-25606723-20160528220619

Maltalidenta Kwuitidherali wrote:

Tybereous wrote: Heart, this is absolute bullshit.

Do you have any idea how many went insane? Any idea? And how many are still broken, but keep there sanity only by distracting themselves with other things? Ty's a broken, crazy, suicidal, bitter, tortured soul. He hides it well most of the time, because that's what he was trained to do. But he is broken. The original Tormented Elves are all similar to this in some respect. The next generation, although inheriting the lust for death from their fathers, are slightly less broken. The only things that keep them together is their need to live, as much as they hate life, and their need to do something, anything, to redeem their actions in the First Age.

You are right about my elves being broken. But you are wrong about them working together for a common purpose. They are not animals.

Balanced? YES ABSOLUTELY! They can't attack anything down south for their lives! They have almost impenetrable defense and a great spy network, granted,but they have almost 0 power in the south.

Awesome? YES ABSOLUTELY! Interesting and Tolkien-friendly lore, good characters, and yes, balance. What more do you want?

Contradicts Tolkien? NO! Never, ever is it it said that something couldn't rise from the ashes of Utumno. Nothing is ever said about Utumno, in fact, after it's defeat! So my faction is perfectly viable. It is never said that Morgoth did not preserve a select few to replace Orcs for spy networking and assassinations. Orcs are clumsy morons when it comes to individual stealth. Plus I have a certain creative license. Absolute bullshit? That may be, but not all of it. And I'll leave it to people to judge for themselves which parts.

They would not, however, be able to form any sort of organised leadership. Your depiction of "Ty" is what I'd expect from the best of them. Perhaps, say, 1/100. There would be more just flat out refusing to do certain things, with severe PTSD etc. They wouldn't be able to form any sort of "next generation" beyond a couple of them, and those few would count for extremely little.

They are so broken in lore, that they are little more than animals. And they are extremely few. Utumno is made up of creatures, not "tormented elves". Indeed, they'd be nigh obsolete at the point of Utumno's destruction in the face of Orcs. There's little need for them.

They shouldn't even have a small part of Utumno, let alone be organised. There's just too few to even compare to anything you suggest.

Interesting? Sure. Lore-abiding? Not really. Good? That depends upon everything else. Balanced? Certainly not, for where they should be. The laws of reality bring you right back to Earth.

"Never, ever is it it said that something couldn't rise from the ashes of Utumno." And nor are pink velociraptors. That isn't a valid excuse.

"Nothing is ever said about Utumno, in fact, after it's defeat!" But enough is said before to make it unreasonable of the way in which you state it to have continued.

"For spy networking and assassinations" but how on Earth can you say they'd be better? And they'd be entirely terrible at 'fitting in'. Your whole argument resolves around an overestimation of their abilities.

"I have creative licence" and I will also now just point out that the laws of reality don't just disappear in Arda. Sure, there are weird creatures and an element of the unknown, but the laws of physics still exist, PTSD still exists, the fact that Utumno wouldn't re-emerge in the way you say also exists. You have no basis for that assumption. And remember, it took the entirety of the first, second, and third ages to make it what it is today. It's not like a bunch of people just "popped up".

There is absolutely NOTHING said about them in lore. I suggest you quote lore if you're going to say that, because I've never read anything to that effect.

Again, your opinion. Not your faction, not your rules. A huge assumption.

It's a DAMNED FANTASY UNIVERSE! Reality doesn't always apply, and there are no laws of reality hindering me here anyways!

That's a red herring fallacy. If you're going to argue, do it right.

Because that's what they were CREATED to do! Read the lore.

Physics are not even related to this conversation. Honestly, heart.