Thread:Patrick.vtap/@comment-27097330-20160904202547/@comment-26347028-20160905065854

ChazmanianDevil wrote: Maltalidenta Kwuitidherali wrote: ChazmanianDevil wrote: There's nothing saying Umbar can't be a naval power. There can be pirate naval powers. It isn't Somalia. Nothing else is a naval power in any real way. The elven ships would probably be considered a navy, in comparison to most. The fact that a shabby group of sailors could be pretty much uncontested by Gondor is proof enough of how little there was to oppose them. And if there's so little, you're hardly going to waste your time on big flagships etc. Again you assume they're shabby sailors. It was stated Gondor had a decent navy, so they would have had to keep up with them. It was stated at times Gondor had a decent navy, and if you also look at it it is in those times where Gondor pretty much hands Umbar's head to itself on a plate.